Reso tuning and strings in Slide It On Over Forum

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Reso tuning and strings

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Hankak	Reso tuning and strings	Lead	[-]
10/05/11 9:10 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Tags : None Yesterday I acquired used PBSM was tuned G......GBDGBD. Today I had my first 1 hour lesson that included the basics and starting with tabs to Steel Guitar Rag. My teacher suggested getting differnet stouter strings and tuning to E....EBG#EDE. My first question was why and the response was ..."G tuning is good for two or three lessons but I can teach you so much more with E tuning." He did a great job of teaching me acoustic and has been teaching for several decades and is very good steel guitar player. I know nothing on either topic...that being E tuning and stouter strings. All opinions welcome. thanks Hank
Freeman		#1	[-]
10/06/11 10:11 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Hank - here is my opinion and very limited experience. Please temper it with comments from others. 1 - "High bass" or "Dobro" G (GBDGBD) is the "standard" bluegrass lap style dobro tuning. The arguement is that a good dobro player can play in any major key in this tuning and by slanting the bar, pick up the minor, 7th and other notes to allow him or her to play with the other instruments in a bluegrass group. I have noodled around with High Bass G and there are many good instructional materials for this style, but it will be more oriented towards bluegrass. The most common string sets for this tuning will be 16 to 56 or so, they will be under much more tension than mediums on your Martin (you have tuned the bottom two up from standard tuning). A spider bridge instrument can take the increased tension because the legs of the spider support much of the down force rather than having it go directly into the cone (those strings and tuning on a biscuit could crush the cone). Other common tunings include standard open G (DGDGBD) (all are listed low to high). This is the delta bottle neck blues tuning of Robert Johnson and many others. A variant of open G is open A, same tuning but two half steps higher - RJ probably tune up but I'll come back to my thoughts about open A vs G. Open G and High Bass G are very similar except for the bottom two strings - with a little thought you can move back and forth between them. Another common open tuning is open D (DADF#AD), again, tuning down from standard. This is another great blues tuning and is used by many lap style players including Kelly Joe Phelps, John Fahey, Ben Harper, David Lindley. I think it is a slightly "prettier" tuning than open G, which to me is a little "nastier". The variation of open D is to tune up two half steps to open E (EBEG#BE) - I think this is the one you are talking about. By the way, I play Steel Guitar Rag in D. Another cool thing about open D is that you can transpose most open G songs by simply moving everything one string towards the bass side. Tuning up to either A or E places a lot more tension on your neck (each half step is about 10 percent). Your guitar was designed for high bass G with 16 - 56's, if you tune up OR put phatter strings on it you will be increasing the tension dramatically. Tuning down won't hurt a guitar, tuning up might (a friend tuned my biscuit bridge guitar to open A and crushed the cone). Before your follow your instructors advice, please spend some time with a string tension calculator (I can help, but start with the one in the UMGF FAQ) to make sure you are not doing damage. If you want to experiment with open E/D tune down to D - it will sound exactly the same. If you have to play with others who are in E there are special capos made for square neck guitars. A fourth tuning is open C (CGCGBE) - John Fahey and Leo Kottke use it a bit. There is at least one more common lap tuning that comes from the lap steel world, C6 and I know nothing about it LOL. The classic "Sleep Walk" is in C6, however I do a poor version in open G.
NealP		#2	[-]
10/06/11 1:08 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Freeman wrote: A fourth tuning is open C (CGCGBE) - John Fahey and Leo Kottke use it a bit. CGCGCE, Fahey/Kottke/ others. You would've noticed it sooner or later. Love this tuning. Been in it for weeks now.
Albamadave		#3	[-]
10/06/11 1:49 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	GBDGBD is almost universally used for squareneck resonator (dobro) playing. Resonator guitar greats Jerry Douglas and Rob Ickes rarely stray from it and have no difficulty using it for genres beyond bluegrass. There is also more instructional material and tab available in this tuning for dobro than any other. If your instructor can only come up with 2 or 3 lessons in this tuning, it's only because he is totally unfamiliar with it. Yes, as others have suggested, there are many other tunings available but my suggestion is to learn GBDGBD first and branch out from there. Best of luck! Dave
Hankak		#4	[-]
10/06/11 2:08 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Now that I've selected the PBSM, I see I have to select a tuning. Intereting stuff but too many options! So what do you guys have to say about my instructors E tuning.......EBG#EDE Is E more common on pedal steel since that's what he's really into. As an aside he mentioned that back in the 1940s after WWII where he was a P51 fighter pilot he had and played a Dobro for many years and it was his first reso. Thanks Hank
Albamadave		#5	[-]
10/06/11 2:24 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Hank, I suspect that he is primarily a pedal steel player and is suggesting this tuning because he is familiar with it as a pedal player. The dobro and the approach and techniques for playing it has changed considerably since 1940. Get several opinions over at the Resohangout where folks play dobro as their first instrument and there are many instructors. http://www.resohangout.com/. Dave
Freeman		#6	[-]
10/07/11 2:07 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Hankak wrote: Now that I've selected the PBSM, I see I have to select a tuning. Intereting stuff but too many options! So what do you guys have to say about my instructors E tuning.......EBG#EDE Is E more common on pedal steel since that's what he's really into. As an aside he mentioned that back in the 1940s after WWII where he was a P51 fighter pilot he had and played a Dobro for many years and it was his first reso. Thanks Hank As I said before, be very very careful tuning any guitar UP to E or A, do the string tension math first (best thing to do is calculate the tension for the tuning and strings hat the guitar was made for and don't exceed it - reso or standard acoustic). If you want to play in open E use lighter guage strings and maybe reduce the break angle. The other option is to get a square neck capo (Beard) and capo open D at 2 - you can play along with your instructor all you want. Second, I love the variant of open E, which is open D. I keep my Weissenborn in D all the time. Again, it does depend a bit on the music you want to play - if I was going to play exclusively bluegrass or try to emulate Douglas et al, it would be GBDGBD, but since I like blues and what Fahey called "American Primative" I prefer open D or G. Neal, you are right - I knew there was one string that went up. I have an old Yamaha that stays in open C with lights on top and mediums on the bottom. There is a whole essay on John Fahey's web site about C - he played some of his prettiest stuff, but also some very dark things in that tuning.
Freeman		#7	[-]
10/11/11 2:35 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I ran the numbers very quickly and you should be OK tuning to E. Based on a set of normal "resophonic" strings (JP, Beard, D'Addario) of 0.016, 0.018, 0.028, 0.036, 0.046 and 0.056 I get 211 pounds for high bass G and 215 for open E. They are less balanced in E and you may wish to adjust some gauges, but the important thing is that you won't destroy your guitar. However, note that 215 pounds is a whole lot more than the usual 160-180 on a normal flat top with lights or mediums tuned to concert.
Hankak		#8	[-]
10/11/11 7:28 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Hey Freeman Thanks for the info. I checked the Godltone site at: http://www.goldtone.com/resources/string_gauges.asp and it has about the same (within a thou) as you list but nothing on tunings and tension. I appreciate your efforts. Now I can move on. Hank
Freeman		#9	[-]
10/12/11 11:14 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	The numbers are from the D'Addario string tension pdf on their web site and they are very unbalanced for open E. I am still queasy about tuning up, frankly if it was my guitar I would change the "resophonic" set to a more normal set of mediums (13-56) with maybe a 15 or 16 on top and tune to D. Right now my Weissenborn and tricone are in open D with mediums, my spider bridge dobro is in normal open G with mediums. They are all working fine and I don't have to worry about them imploding durning the night.
Hankak		#10	[-]
10/12/11 5:36 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Here's a shades guy Ed Dowling tuning to open E on this video. http://www.ehow.com/video...-tuning-dobro-slide.html I haven't done it yet and am still investigating Hank PS These guys like Ed, Hank Williams Jr, etc must have very sensitve eyes or some kind of ego....which is it? Last Edited By: Hankak 10/12/11 9:11 PM. Edited 1 times.
Walkin Boss		#11	[-]
10/13/11 10:59 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Post deleted - oops. "Going where the wind don't blow so strange." Last Edited By: Walkin Boss 10/13/11 11:01 AM. Edited 1 times.

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Reso tuning and strings

Reso tuning and strings